This was my personal experience, but I found there to be a big jump between Cat 5 and Cat 4. Definitely would have been too-much-too-soon if I'd gone straight into Cat 4.
What I mean is: if a promoter combines cup categories, then it would have to be scored separately. Also, the "Cup points" are a lame excuse to ram specific race categories down promoter's throats. Having 3 Cat 4 fields every race does not necessarily make sense.
Age is not a good determination of ability.
Why not just do 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 in a day? Would still need to split out 3s, 4s, and 5s into age groups because of field size at some large races.
Pre-USAC we didn't have to run cat 5s. This was the reason we needed three cat. 4 fields. Races used to have 75+ in each. With the cat. 5 USAC crap this added one or two more cats per day. See 20 minute Cat. 5 crits...
Go back away from USAC so we can define what makes since with Colorado Demographics. We also have a bunch of "sandbaggers" in the 5s because of the One-Day only in 5s rule.
"BRAC define the Cup categories and let the promoters do whatever makes sense for them on race day"
You can't have a defined CUP Policy then have someone change it at the last minute. What would be the point of having a structured series and show to a race and it be something else.
I don't think BRAC needs to solve the problem; let BRAC define the Cup categories and let the promoters do whatever makes sense for them on race day.
That could mean having Men 4 A and Men 4 B, or it could mean Men 4 and Master's Men 4. If a promoter historically doesn't have too many Cat 4s, he doesn't have to do anything.
Different promoters will come up with different solutions. If you have a short course with lots of turnarounds, you might choose to run fewer categories. If you're running a hill climb, you might only need to run 4 categories.
If we let the promoters be efficient, the entry fees might even go down.
Any big race has two many fours for one field. The obvious way to handle that is to have a masters 4 field. Right now we have three cat 4 fields, and that does seem one more than we need.
Except for Boulder Roubaix and a couple cross races, I don't think there are ever too many 3s for a single field.
I don't quite understand why we need Master's categories that are limited by category. If you're a 41-year-old Cat 3, either race 40+ or Senior Men 3.
Master's A (40+ Open)
Master's B (50+ Open)
Men P12
Men 3
Men 4
Men 5
Women P12
Women 3
Women 4
Also, I would allow combined fields at the PROMOTER'S DISCRETION so long as the results are split out for Cup purposes. So Men 3/4 or Men 4/5 or Men P123 would all be good, just publish it in your flyer.
This year the Gila made the mistake of introducing a Master's B field, which instead of adding registrants just resulted in smaller Master's A and Men's 3 fields.
Just for reference, here are the categories from a pretty big summer road race on the east coast: P12, 3, 4, 5, 40+, 50+, Women P123, Women 3/4.
This was my personal experience, but I found there to be a big jump between Cat 5 and Cat 4. Definitely would have been too-much-too-soon if I'd gone straight into Cat 4.
What I mean is: if a promoter combines cup categories, then it would have to be scored separately. Also, the "Cup points" are a lame excuse to ram specific race categories down promoter's throats. Having 3 Cat 4 fields every race does not necessarily make sense.
Raced Superior Morgul and Boulder RR several times. Maybe I'm fitter this year!
The full course was pretty effective at dropping riders, for a supposedly easier race.
Age is not a good determination of ability.
Why not just do 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 in a day? Would still need to split out 3s, 4s, and 5s into age groups because of field size at some large races.
Pre-USAC we didn't have to run cat 5s. This was the reason we needed three cat. 4 fields. Races used to have 75+ in each. With the cat. 5 USAC crap this added one or two more cats per day. See 20 minute Cat. 5 crits...
Go back away from USAC so we can define what makes since with Colorado Demographics. We also have a bunch of "sandbaggers" in the 5s because of the One-Day only in 5s rule.
"BRAC define the Cup categories and let the promoters do whatever makes sense for them on race day"
You can't have a defined CUP Policy then have someone change it at the last minute. What would be the point of having a structured series and show to a race and it be something else.
The is CUP policy for all the read on http://www.coloradocycling.org/.
Races, registration, flyers are planned more than 30 days in advance.
I don't think BRAC needs to solve the problem; let BRAC define the Cup categories and let the promoters do whatever makes sense for them on race day.
That could mean having Men 4 A and Men 4 B, or it could mean Men 4 and Master's Men 4. If a promoter historically doesn't have too many Cat 4s, he doesn't have to do anything.
Different promoters will come up with different solutions. If you have a short course with lots of turnarounds, you might choose to run fewer categories. If you're running a hill climb, you might only need to run 4 categories.
If we let the promoters be efficient, the entry fees might even go down.
Any big race has two many fours for one field. The obvious way to handle that is to have a masters 4 field. Right now we have three cat 4 fields, and that does seem one more than we need.
Except for Boulder Roubaix and a couple cross races, I don't think there are ever too many 3s for a single field.
I don't quite understand why we need Master's categories that are limited by category. If you're a 41-year-old Cat 3, either race 40+ or Senior Men 3.
Master's A (40+ Open)
Master's B (50+ Open)
Men P12
Men 3
Men 4
Men 5
Women P12
Women 3
Women 4
Also, I would allow combined fields at the PROMOTER'S DISCRETION so long as the results are split out for Cup purposes. So Men 3/4 or Men 4/5 or Men P123 would all be good, just publish it in your flyer.
This year the Gila made the mistake of introducing a Master's B field, which instead of adding registrants just resulted in smaller Master's A and Men's 3 fields.
Just for reference, here are the categories from a pretty big summer road race on the east coast: P12, 3, 4, 5, 40+, 50+, Women P123, Women 3/4.